I fully expect people to hate this post.
One of the things I am responsible for is recommending or not recommending new technologies for Lessing-Flynn clients. Whether I want to or not, I have to try this stuff out. I’ve been dreading/debating this post for about a month now, and I think it’s time to say it.
I’m not hip to Foursquare.
Sure, I’ve “checked” into places. I’ve explored. I’ve checked the leaderboard. I’ve played the game. I’ve seen what it’s all about… and I’ll pass.
You may dig Foursquare, and that’s cool, but I think I’m on the wrong side of the demographic. As much as I enjoy the novelty of being the Mayor of Ted’s Coney Island, I still don’t get any perks other than some Twitter love from Romelle Slaughter:
Thanks, Romelle. The mayor throne is yours for the taking.
Look, I don’t mind that The Brand Chef and the Blogfather know I am @ TGI Friday’s “with the fam, holla!” because I am pretty sure those guys won’t rob my home. It’s the guy I met one time somewhere random who’s name seemed vaguely familiar when I accepted his friendship that I am worried about. Your response: “Only accept people you know really well to be your friends.”
That’s all well and good until someone like me does this:
Now that random guy who only wants to rob my house may think Romelle may not be home for a while either. Did Romelle want me to retweet that? Since he protects his tweets, my guess is not. So, there is no control. There is no “don’t retweet” button.
There are going to be arguments that once you put your stuff/content/bio/personality/pictures on the internet that it’s pretty much fair game. The world will see it and you have to deal with that. I am ok with all of that with the exception of people knowing my location. This is just a bit too creepy – even for me.
I know I’m not the only one who feels like a total dork going to a business dinner and feeling obligated to check in at the Star Bar. Now granted, Star Bar rocks, and letting the social world know I’m about to go teeth first into a Cuban sandwich makes me feel like a poorly groomed metro sexual. It says, “Josh is Baller. Josh is a player.” No it doesn’t, it says, “Josh’s dumb ass ain’t home right now.”
I recently read one guy saying he actually sneaks into the bathroom to check in to places or does it under the tablecloth. I check in while I’m in still in the car, and for what? In hopes that someday La Hacienda (I’m mayor there too) will give me a free lunch chimichanga? Companies like Wellman’s don’t even have a Web site, let alone a Facebook page. These people are supposed to be hip to Foursquare?
I’ll tip my hat to places like Amici Espresso, Smokey Row and the Mars Cafe for satisfying all of us “early technology adopters” with “free coffee for the mayor” offers. It’s probably good for businesses that so many want to be the mayor of the Mars Cafe. Kudos to John Pemble’s current status as Mayor – that couldn’t have been easy! The problem is, that for every mayor of a place, and there can be only one mayor, there are thirty people checking in that will never get squat.
I’m pretty sure that this post is going to sound ridiculous five years from now. But at the moment Foursquare is ahead of it’s time, a waste of time and doesn’t provide any value to me personally. Sure, the three companies that have offers and the three people that are mayors benefit, but what about the rest of us? How is Foursquare socially valuable for the non mayors? It’s not, and most people are probably spending more money on coffee than they probably should.
Maybe if you’re a college kid and want to hook up with fringe friends at the bar I would see the value.
Maybe if more businesses made offers beyond items for the mayor.
Maybe if there were businesses other than coffee shops on Foursquare it’d be worth my time.
Maybe if there was a GPS gotcha button, i.e. “Josh is @ 801 Steak & Chop House.” No you didn’t!” That’s a lot of MAYBES for me.
I’ll probably be back to Foursquare when it actually offers me or my clients value. Right now, it’s too early in the game to continue checking in every time I pull into a parking lot. If you like Foursquare, great, keep playing. As for me. I’m checking out. I’m not hip to Foursquare.
Author: Josh Fleming
www.lessingflynn.com
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{ 24 comments… read them below or add one }
Josh – We have had Foursquare for all of…what…3 months! I would argue it is way too early to judge the cover of that book as the retail world in DSM has yet to catch up. I hear you, Wellman's may never be on Foursquare, but other businesses will be and hopefully it will be in our benefit to continue to check in. I would have to assume businesses will go as far as to see how many check-ins people-who-are-not-mayors have…so those people will receive some sort of benefit for their patronage. Who knows, it is only the first inning and Josh is already throwing in the towel…(for the record I realize I mixed analogies there.)
Great post.
After using FourSquare for about 2 weeks I couldn't find the value of using 4SQ as a consumer. There was one instance where someone left a "Tip" to try something – and I did, and it was good.
On that note – I've quit using it. The game model is fun until you realize there is no point and little value to the end user. Once they can balance the benefit between the consumer and business it may create value. I don't see that happening much soon.
I see far more value in Google Buzz Mobile (as it's integrated with Maps and Local Listings) for both businesses and consumers.
Also I know people have been getting annoyed at 4SQ in tweets. I tend to agree with these people although I don't care nearly enough to tweet about it (Often that's more annoying anyway).
Great post!
I wouldn't say I am throwing in the towel. I would say I have suffered a T.K.O. and will be looking for a rematch in 18-24 months provided Don King promotes the event. : )
I didn't embrace Foursquare because I would still like to maintain some sort of private life. No need for people to see me check in at my bank
This is EXACTLY my problem with Foursquare. Unless there's significant buy-in from a business, and deals for all and not just the mayor, it's not really worth my time or effort to participate. Plus, there's a hint of cyber-stalking with it that doesn't thrill me.
My brother and I were talking about this, and he suggested that historical societies or museums use it for interactive walking tours. The City of Chicago actually has plotted historical sites on Foursquare, where you can get badges and information. I can see practical uses for it, but for the most part, it's the latest shiny toy.
I would be more into Foursquare if I could be the homecoming queen of Ted's Coney Island instead of the chick that just dines there with the Mayor.
Andy – agreed with the Tweets and Facebook updates. I have mine set up to only tweet or update when I become the Mayor of places, not each time…and I wish others would follow suit. But, like you, I don't care enough about their updates to comment on it.
Couldn't agree more, Josh…well said. Foursquare was a game we enjoyed as kids, and I feel that youngsters (did I just say youngsters?) might be the only people that can truly enjoy this version of Foursquare.
@Josh – Yea I was just going to say that I asked the same question about Twitter in the early days – "Where's the value"
In reality Twitter suffered from the network effect…. ie "Who am I going to email when I'm the only one that has email"
I have a feeling 4SQ is the same – We'll see.
Thanks for the comments, folks.
@Andy I found value with Twitter almost immediately and could make an argument for every company and person to use Twitter. Verdict is still out on 4SQ. Wouldn't be the first time I was wrong. : )
@rockabelly – I was never good at 4SQ as a kid, maybe that feeds my disdain for the 2010 version.
I am not a Foursquare user myself either. The one thing that I see could be a problem for those who use it is for single women or anyone for that matter that broadcasts where they are. This is where I get concerned for those who do this since you never know in today's day and age if there is someone stalking you online. Scary thought, but something to think about if someone continues to indicate where they check in at.
I'm with you Josh, right now the rewards don't match the time it takes to mess with the application. Word.
@Josh – I'm just saying there wasn't much value on Twitter in 2007 – because not many people were on it.. We had 5 people at the first #dmtweetup for example.
It seems to me as relevant as Google Buzz. Why do we need this??
I like to have a social media-life balance. I am on Twitter, Facebook, blogging, surfing the web all day long. When I am going out for Mexican or cocktails after work, I'm going to *NOT* think about what I should be tweeting at the moment or posting to my growing list of networks. That is my break from all that is social media. I love social media, but half the people who are my "friends" on 4SQ I have never met and frankly, they don't need to know what I'm doing at the moment.
If you are visiting Des Moines and want a 20-something's tips for fun stuff to do, there are plenty of ways you could ping me and ask. My boyfriend would never take me out to a nice dinner if I was posting on Foursquare underneath the table while we actually could spend some time together away from other distractions. While I do have a Foursquare account, I don't currently see a point to using it.
I agree with most of what you said. I do have to "sort of" disagree with you. Recently I went on vacation to Hawaii, a place I've never been before. We knew we wanted to go out for dinner but did not know where… I could have asked the concierge, I could have gotten on a computer, but I'm lazy. I got out my android and pulled up foursquare and looked at "nearby venues" To my surprise there was about 50 venuse within walking distance from our hotel. I noticed that "when at the Hula grill, try the Hoisson ribs, they rock". So I did, and yes, they did rock. I also looked like Captain Brainiac because i knew these tidbits.
Obviously if you are in your own home town you aren't going to need this info. And damnit Kum and Go reward me for being the only idiot who "checks in" at your Pleasant Hill location. Even if its a "thanks for stopping in today Mr. Mayor.
Josh,
I have to agree with @Ben Cox above. When I'm in Manhattan or in any of the neighborhoods in the NYC area I can pull out 4SQ and find a nice place to eat or relax or have a cuppa joe. Yes there are other applications for that, but I just like my friends recommendations a little more than the general public's. My friends will note things like wifi and computer friendly coffee houses etc.
Perhaps this isn't so handy in middle America where you drive everywhere you go. But in a major city where walking is a primary mode of transportation it's very handy.
Great conversation…
I think it's early to tell…but if you ask me it's getting Booooring! I never remember to check in, half the time my app freezes, and I obviously don't venture out enough to be the mayor anywhere! My only hope is that I can oust @iowarealestate one of these days…otherwise, I'm useless in the Foursquare world.
Good to see what others think!
Interesting thoughts, Josh. I don't hate your post but I do disagree with much of it
I enjoy foursquare and see a lot of potential in how businesses use it. I'm surprised to see you pass on it so quickly and especially to determine that it offers your clients no value (though I can understand that you, as an individual, don't enjoy the game).
I think that businesses need to care about foursquare now because the mobile/location-based web is the next thing and the early adopters are the ones that get to set the platform's direction. Twitter was originally designed to share status updates and Facebook was designed for Mark Zuckerburg to meet girls but we all know that they both have become much more. Each evolved over time as the community adopted them. The mobile web is next and your clients need to care about it.
In the end, foursquare may not win out but something, such as gowalla, buzz, or geo-located tweets, definitely will and I'm planning now to be a part of it.
Thanks again for all the comments. It's nice to know that people feel so open about sharing here.
@ben-cox and @chris-kieff – you raise excellent points – the idea of foursquare while not in your home base or while in major metros like NYC certainly have appeal, but in both of your cases, you didn't need to check in to get value. Sounds to me like there may be a market for a restaurant review as detailed as say, TripAdvisor.com
@amber_salmon – I struggled with the boredem part as well. Businesses need to find a way to keep this interesting by offering more than just items for the mayor.
@geoff_wood Several thoughts here.
I would't say I have passed on 4SQ, I'm just on the sidelines. Big business is not ready for this yet, that's a fact. It's one small social media tool in a 360 degree approach. Sure, it has its place, but am I going to recommend a foursquare account before Twitter, Facebook or a blog? Most likely not.
I have no doubt that mobile/location based web will be important, I'm just not ready to declare it "the next thing." I am willing to say that "mobile based technology" will be the next thing, whether or not 'location' is involved remains to be seen. Clearly, if products like the iPhone, iPad or the Kindle had no location aspect to them, they would still be considered important pieces of technology.
You wrote, "The mobile web is next and your clients need to care about it." While I don't believe it was your intention to suggest that we don't believe the mobile web is important, I need to clarify this point with you, our clients and our readers. We think its very important. In fact, we are in the initial stages of developing mobile applications for multiple clients. You'll probably even read about it in May. (If we're lucky!) : )
I liken 4SQ to Classmates or Friendster – they were close, but not quite what we were looking for until Facebook came along. Maybe 4SQ will evolve and take off, until then, my account will sit dormant as I wait see if the reward exceeds the risk.
All – good debate here folks! Smiles all around on this one. : )
Thanks for the follow up, Josh!
I didn't mean to infer anything on Lessing-Flynn's strategy nor am I an expert on the services you offer your clients. I apologize if it came off that way.
The overarching point I was trying to make is that it can be advantageous to jump in early and help evolve the platform to meet the needs of one's business and clients, but that is just my opinion. For better or worse, I'm not the type to "wait and see"; I recognize that there are advantages in that approach, too.
The comparison to Classmates and Friendster is an interesting one but like Andy said above, it could just as easily be compared to Twitter (where many of us jumped in, didn't see the value, and bailed early).
As for the risk of using location-based services, I tend to think along the lines of what was communicated in this post that Nathan Wright tweeted the other day: http://waxy.org/2010/02/regarding_foursquare_and_...
Thanks for the forum and generating the discussion!
Like I said, Geoff, smiles all around on this one. : )
I agree and disagree at the same time. It may not be the most profitable tool for your clients right now, but that day is coming.
Reminds me of the hydrogen car. No one will buy one because there are no stations. There are no stations because there are no cars.
Businesses (like Mars, Amici, and Teds) HAVE to take the initiative here.
EX: Upon my visit to Drake Diner, foursquare popped up a little flag that said "Special Nearby". When I tapped on it, it was informing Mars Cafe (around the block) had a special complete with tips. Now THAT is powerful.
PS. I heard a rumor that another company is joining the FourSquare to offer more value to their customers. Stay tuned…
Not good. If I told anyone where I was I would have to kill them. It's ninja month for me and I have several pieces of wet work to complete. Foursquare might provide them with a warning.
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